Anyone played black geyser or other pillars of eternity/badur's gate alike recommendations?

[rpggamer329182]

Well met fellow rpg fans.

Black geyser looks very nice stylistically. I haven't bought a game in years. I would have to really be into a game to put down money for it.

I would have maybe bought it if it was around £15 max but due to the mixed reviews the asking price of £30 seems too much for a gamble.

Pillars 1 is the best game I have played in as long as I can remember. It is funny writing that because it had to grow on me. I remember playing it when it first came out around 2015 and got bored and uninstalled very early. That was also in large part due to me being in a different point in life then, being very much a workaholic and go getter and guilt tripping myself for playing games.

Tried again only a couple of years ago and even on the second try I would just peck at it and be mostly indifferent. Then somehow suddenly I thought this is amazing!

I still didn't burn through it like some games even then. I would just nibble at it but the nibbles gradually got bigger and bigger until I was close to finishing it. The fondness grew over time like a slow burning fire rather than a roaring flame. Like someone you initially saw no attraction for you slowly find yourself growing in interest for as you get to know them better.

While I also played pathfinder kingmaker and thought the combat better and more true to the classics in that one, pillars won by a big margin due to the darker more gritty graphics and amazing music and lore/world building.

Pathfinder I hated the stupid cartoon graphics. Oh and the recycled zones but that is somewhat expected from such a big game. Really wrecked immersion for me but the combat was so faithful to the old school genre that is what kept me playing.

The hand drawn backgrounds of pillars and classic 2d isometrics is far more engrossing. With that said how bad did neverwinter nights age? I remember being so addicted to that game for a couple of years, playing online spending most of my days and turning down friends to go out. Now though I would really have to try and get into it again as the 3d graphics just look bad to my eye. Kind of like how laughable babylon 5's computer generated graphics look now.

Hand drawn games still look pretty much as good as the day they came out. All it takes is perhaps a resolution bump to tidy up the rough edges but certainly would not be a deal breaker to play in original resolutions.

Pillars was much easier and the combat just forgettable a lot of the time but the world building and atmosphere was amazing such that I didn't really care about the combat. I found myself getting lost in the world sometimes just sitting there doing nothing taking it in or just exploring with no particular aim.

I was almost brought to tears once or twice when some poignant music came at a milestone moment. Or just the background brooding music giving me great melancholy feelings.

I love these types of games! Could write thousands of words on them without even thinking about it!

Oh and btw I don't really like the look of baldur's gate 3. Just being 3d puts me off. Much prefer the 2d isos. Though I see it seems to have gotten monumentally high scores. It would be interesting to play in its own right but I would not expect it to play or feel like its predecessors.

I have not been a fan of larian games previous either. I tried DOS2 I believe and got annoyed with the 'gags' and breaking of the 3rd wall all the time which again ruined immersion for me. I want to get lost in these worlds and forget about the real world for a while, not be reminded of the existence of it.

Oh and btw I hated pillars 2, which would be the obvious next move. I disliked the combat changes but the most annoying thing was the ridiculous level stripping with no good in game reason. Sure maybe they could make a tenuous reason for you losing your power - soul reset or whatnot but then all your companions are back to being toddlers again too with no explanation.

The head cannon required to manage that was just a bridge to far not to mention the silly chasing around king kong premise.

 

[Antimatter]

Hi there and welcome to the forum!

We had a thread about Black Geyser, check it out: https://tavernrpg.com/threads/black-geyser-couriers-of-darkness.121

We also had this mini-review of the game by @Skatan https://tavernrpg.com/threads/what-game-are-you-currently-playing.192/post-10179 and here: https://tavernrpg.com/threads/what-game-are-you-currently-playing.192/post-10118

As for your main question, I'd say the best option is to give a game a chance. Any game. Be it PoE 1, which you gave a chance after the initial "meh" phase, or BG3 which you're dismissing based on the look. BG3 is one of those RPGs that must be played by every RPG fan.

I can also recommend Pathfinder 2: while you didn't like Kingmaker, the second game is generally more polished, advanced, has better backgrounds and better maps overall. @Serg_BlackStrider would say that he still prefers Kingmakers though.

And about PoE 2, there are people who like that game more than PoE 1. Would tag @O_Bruce for his opinion on this, and @Enuhal

 

[O_Bruce]

Since I've been tagged... First of all, welcome!

Second and the reason I was tagged in the first place: Pillars of Eternity. If I was to compare the two PoE games to each other, I would say that the first game is better in story department, but the second game is better in-game mechanics and role-playing elements. PoE2 is also shorter than the first game in terms of the main story - but then again, at some point the story of PoE2 gave me a valid reason to explore the Deadfire Archipelago, which also was informed by a choice I decided to make (or not to make - I won't spoil it here).

Finally and other than that, I see some pattern here: you seem to not want to give games a further chance based on relatively small reasons. Under this circumstance, it would be very hard to recommend any game to you.

 

[Skatan]

hello and welcome!

I can give some short notes on Black Geyser since it wasn't that long ago I played it, ca 1,5 times. One full length playthrough and another half one solo/hardest just to test.

In short, I'd say it's closest equivalent is Baldur's Gate 1. It has a quite similar setup with the map, the banter (ie little of it), companions but they aren't very well fleshed out, cool drawn areas but they can feel quite empty at times. That's the negatives, ie the game feels a bit empty and as if it had a greater scope planned but not executed.

However, it's cheap. You mention 30 bucks but it's on sale every month (I know because I had it on my wish list for a year or so and I got many notifications it was on sale.). IIRC I bought it at 50% but I can't remember now. No matter, IMHO it was worth what I paid! And it was a good entry game for a new developing company. I will for sure check out their future games based on my experience with Black Geyser.

The game has many cool ideas, but with less than stellar execution. The "greed" thing sounds cool but I never noticed it making any difference. I played a standard lawful-goodish character so it meant I raised the greed levels basically the lowest they could, so I never understood what that did or if my choices actually made any impact on the world. But the maps are fun, the classes and builds are interesting and novel enough to keep me entertained. It was also fairly easy to get into the mechanics and build decent characters even going in blind. I made a rogueish character, persuasion based, and he turned out to be a DPS guy in the end too which was fun.

The maps are very nice, oldschool style. Some of them are a bit too big and empty as mentioned, but that's fine - you get what you pay for. The whole game was not very long which IMHO is a good thing sometimes, because it means I will finish them before I lose interest.

The fights were kinda fun though you have a bit less actions and spells then other RPGs, but instead you use them more often. Mages get a huge number of spell slots so you can cast spells in all fights and never feel you have to save them for the future. I like that, I find DnD style mages lacking in that regard a lot of times.

So I recommend the game, but just put it on your wish list and wait for the next sale if you are uncertain.

 

[rpggamer329182]

Hi there and welcome to the forum!

We had a thread about Black Geyser, check it out: https://tavernrpg.com/threads/black-geyser-couriers-of-darkness.121

We also had this mini-review of the game by @Skatan https://tavernrpg.com/threads/what-game-are-you-currently-playing.192/post-10179 and here: https://tavernrpg.com/threads/what-game-are-you-currently-playing.192/post-10118

As for your main question, I'd say the best option is to give a game a chance. Any game. Be it PoE 1, which you gave a chance after the initial "meh" phase, or BG3 which you're dismissing based on the look. BG3 is one of those RPGs that must be played by every RPG fan.

I can also recommend Pathfinder 2: while you didn't like Kingmaker, the second game is generally more polished, advanced, has better backgrounds and better maps overall. @Serg_BlackStrider would say that he still prefers Kingmakers though.

And about PoE 2, there are people who like that game more than PoE 1. Would tag @O_Bruce for his opinion on this, and @Enuhal

Thanks, it's strange. I was unable to login yesterday and my post was gone. I thought I might have been erroneously tagged as a bot and had my account deleted. Seems people are more trigger happy with false positives these days in the age of AI.

I thought I would try one last time and I could login again and replies are received.

I forgot to add a pretty heavy restriction is that my hd on this machine is only 60gb! I played PFK on my desktop which I no longer have ready access to.

So will probably have to mine older or less taxing indie games.

Well you say give it a chance but you must pay money to give games a chance which I may not like. So the chance comes at a cost and may be money down the drain if I didn't like it. Black geyser certainly has the look I like.

I would say I like world building and atmosphere above other things like combat, which I went into in the OP.

 

[rpggamer329182]

Since I've been tagged... First of all, welcome!

Second and the reason I was tagged in the first place: Pillars of Eternity. If I was to compare the two PoE games to each other, I would say that the first game is better in story department, but the second game is better in-game mechanics and role-playing elements. PoE2 is also shorter than the first game in terms of the main story - but then again, at some point the story of PoE2 gave me a valid reason to explore the Deadfire Archipelago, which also was informed by a choice I decided to make (or not to make - I won't spoil it here).

Finally and other than that, I see some pattern here: you seem to not want to give games a further chance based on relatively small reasons. Under this circumstance, it would be very hard to recommend any game to you.

As above, I don't want to risk wasting money on a game I would not like.

One man's mountain is another man's molehill. I just have a good sense of what I like and don't like in an rpg. Also like mentioned I don't want to spend money on a game I wouldn't like.

If all games were free then sure I could give them a try on a whim but not when there is a decent wedge of cash just to try them.

I know buying and trying games is part of the hobby for some people whether they like them or not but it is not something I do lightly.

 

[rpggamer329182]

hello and welcome!

I can give some short notes on Black Geyser since it wasn't that long ago I played it, ca 1,5 times. One full length playthrough and another half one solo/hardest just to test.

In short, I'd say it's closest equivalent is Baldur's Gate 1. It has a quite similar setup with the map, the banter (ie little of it), companions but they aren't very well fleshed out, cool drawn areas but they can feel quite empty at times. That's the negatives, ie the game feels a bit empty and as if it had a greater scope planned but not executed.

However, it's cheap. You mention 30 bucks but it's on sale every month (I know because I had it on my wish list for a year or so and I got many notifications it was on sale.). IIRC I bought it at 50% but I can't remember now. No matter, IMHO it was worth what I paid! And it was a good entry game for a new developing company. I will for sure check out their future games based on my experience with Black Geyser.

The game has many cool ideas, but with less than stellar execution. The "greed" thing sounds cool but I never noticed it making any difference. I played a standard lawful-goodish character so it meant I raised the greed levels basically the lowest they could, so I never understood what that did or if my choices actually made any impact on the world. But the maps are fun, the classes and builds are interesting and novel enough to keep me entertained. It was also fairly easy to get into the mechanics and build decent characters even going in blind. I made a rogueish character, persuasion based, and he turned out to be a DPS guy in the end too which was fun.

The maps are very nice, oldschool style. Some of them are a bit too big and empty as mentioned, but that's fine - you get what you pay for. The whole game was not very long which IMHO is a good thing sometimes, because it means I will finish them before I lose interest.

The fights were kinda fun though you have a bit less actions and spells then other RPGs, but instead you use them more often. Mages get a huge number of spell slots so you can cast spells in all fights and never feel you have to save them for the future. I like that, I find DnD style mages lacking in that regard a lot of times.

So I recommend the game, but just put it on your wish list and wait for the next sale if you are uncertain.

Thanks for the detailed reply.

Closest to BG1 sounds great. While BG2 was amazing for many different reasons BG1 I felt was darker and my preference for feel.

Ah yes I remember just after writing the OP that I saw it is on 50% off on gog.

How is the world building? You say the game generally feels empty but does this area suffer too? I am guessing there will be little to no lore due to budget constraints but I can head canon that and treat it more like a sandbox experience.

I suppose you already went into the part I am interested in and that is the maps.

The important things for immersion for me are the overall look of the game and if the music is suitable to the tone of the game.

I am not bothered about empty areas as in a roleplaying sense that can be seen as natural - unlike the weird delevelling in POE2 which was just insulting as I felt they were too lazy to make some proper in game explanation for.

Reading a few reviews I really liked the setting and story that they wrote it has, of mainly being a tale of humans and political intrigue. The reviewers were mentioning it as a negative due to little varying in enemies but it is a nice setting to me and Game of Thronesish in that respect.

£15 is at a price point I would consider giving it a go!

 

[Skatan]

How is the world building? You say the game generally feels empty but does this area suffer too? I am guessing there will be little to no lore due to budget constraints but I can head canon that and treat it more like a sandbox experience.

I think the world building was very good! There's a couple of kingdoms, a rebellion, some adjacent kingdoms etc and you visit some of them. There's a high king, some intrigue and you as the player play a pivotal role in all of it. I believe you can choose sides in the conflict, but I went with what felt as the 'canon' choice and didn't play far enough in my second run to try the other side. You broker deals and overall it feels very cool. (Edit: IMHO the main branch felt more like Law vs Chaos than Good vs Evil and I chose Law.)

However, I was in the end quite disappointed in the ending slides as they felt very, very rushed. Don't know why considering that part is so important in these types of games and it wasn't that many different branches of choices that made huge impacts. I would have liked a lot more effects of my choices be seen in the ending slides. But again, to reiterate myself, it's ok for a game of this scope and price. Had this game been released at the time of BG1, back when there were less games to play and less to compare with, it might have been considered a legendary game. Though released recently after a slew of better games over the past decades, it's legacy is that of a minor footnote in the annals of RPGs.

 

[rpggamer329182]

I think the world building was very good! There's a couple of kingdoms, a rebellion, some adjacent kingdoms etc and you visit some of them. There's a high king, some intrigue and you as the player play a pivotal role in all of it. I believe you can choose sides in the conflict, but I went with what felt as the 'canon' choice and didn't play far enough in my second run to try the other side. You broker deals and overall it feels very cool. (Edit: IMHO the main branch felt more like Law vs Chaos than Good vs Evil and I chose Law.)

However, I was in the end quite disappointed in the ending slides as they felt very, very rushed. Don't know why considering that part is so important in these types of games and it wasn't that many different branches of choices that made huge impacts. I would have liked a lot more effects of my choices be seen in the ending slides. But again, to reiterate myself, it's ok for a game of this scope and price. Had this game been released at the time of BG1, back when there were less games to play and less to compare with, it might have been considered a legendary game. Though released recently after a slew of better games over the past decades, it's legacy is that of a minor footnote in the annals of RPGs.

I don't think I will be bothered about the ending. I don't like most endings. When I get the feeling things are winding to a close with a game it feels like 'oh I know what is coming some huge battle to save the world between good and evil'.

On that note it would be good to play an rpg where you are a nobody for a change. I read that age of decadence is good for that.

I struggle to finish most games due the to predictability at the late stage. I like the middle and earlier parts where the world is fresh and full of wonder.

Btw I wasn't able to login again today and was thinking, huh maybe they deleted my account after all. Then I just thought I would try again and could login then saw my error. I was trying rpg pub forum not rpg tavern.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

If you havent tried Tyranny, it's definitely worth a try. It uses the PoE engine and basic systems like stats, but everything about it is more interesting. And I mean everything.

 

[m7600]

I was trying rpg pub forum not rpg tavern.

There's a site called RPG Pub? Which one is that? I'd like to scout it. Do you have a link?

 

[Antimatter]

Yeah, we're not RPG Pub. That site is old and big (compared to this one). But I hope we'll be as big as them eventually (or bigger).

Thanks for clarifying!

 

[rpggamer329182]

There's a site called RPG Pub? Which one is that? I'd like to scout it. Do you have a link?

You can just do what I did, which is what caused the error since I had the details for this one saved in a file but used the other way, and put in 'rpg pub' in the search engine.

I'm not sure how I got the two mixed up in the first place since I searched them through the search engine with 'rpg forums' or such like. They are very similar names so very easy to mix up.

 

[rpggamer329182]

If you havent tried Tyranny, it's definitely worth a try. It uses the PoE engine and basic systems like stats, but everything about it is more interesting. And I mean everything.

Yes I initially passed it over as I thought it was a planescape torment remake and I know people will probably get made at me for this but I didn't get into torment. Not for any reason about the game being bad but I didn't like the grotesque setting and just gave me the creeps!

Probably could have overlooked that given enough effort but I did not as was not particularly motivated to do so.

I just love my cliche medieval fantasy settings! Oh and steampunk is great too so not only that but the creepy setting and discussing torture iirc just gave me heebie jeebies.

I later found out they are unrelated and there is indeed a newer torment game iirc at which point I became more interested in tyranny, given it is a stand alone game.

Ye I just looked it up and the sequel or not sequel but kind of is torment tides of numenera.

Ironically I do like dark settings but not like that! More game of thrones world dark fantasy. Gritty reality vs total phantasmagoria!

 

[m7600]

I have scouted it. I get Early Modern vibes from their site. Ours leans more on the Medieval side. End of story.

 

[Skatan]

Ironically I do like dark settings but not like that! More game of thrones world dark fantasy. Gritty reality vs total phantasmagoria!

Sounds like you would indeed like Tyranny then. It's not very long, it's dark, you are not a nobody (quite the opposite really) but you are not a force of Good either. You start as one of the bad guys basically, and then you the player make your choices and sometimes those choices are between Bad or Worse rather than Good or Evil. It's a refreshing take on the RPG tropes, but a flawed gem due to the rushed latter half of the game unfortunately.

And indeed, Iron Tower games who made Age of Decadence and a few more games, last one was a Colony Ship (Sci-fi), have very, VERY, gritty and dark world building. They also have a quite unique way of writing games where you can't be best at everything and have to choose a path and continue down it. A talker won't be a fighter and vice versa, so don't expect to persuade your way through some parts and fight through others, you choose one or the other. Not both.

Haven't played it myself yet, it's on my wish list along with the next game from the save devs, but Serpent in the Staglands and their upcoming game Banquet for Fools both looks quite grimdark. Might be worth checking out for you, though they are indie and much smaller in scope and scale I assume.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

Tyranny has amazing lore, an amazing setting, one of the best conceptions about magic of any rpg, and it's one of my all time favorite games. Playing Good in a world dominated by Evil is possible, but expect it to be the path of greatest resistance. Indeed, it doesn't even appear to be totally possible at first glance. Even most of your companions will disapprove.

A lot of the advanced magic is not possible to see until a New Game+ run, but the game encourages that anyway with 4 major paths through the game. Your midgame will be different as well depending upon the choices you make for your characters history as well as in game decisions.

I even read (and enjoyed) the short stories about the RPG. They reveal the truth of some mysteries fans debate about to this day

 

[rpggamer329182]

I have scouted it. I get Early Modern vibes from their site. Ours leans more on the Medieval side. End of story.

Ours? You have made a game?

 

[rpggamer329182]

Hi guys, long time no see.

This one never got off the ground as I suddenly was informed Black Geyser would not work on my machine since the laptop is from 2013 and the game requires something like 2gb ram graphics which this one certainly doesn't have, being only intel integrated graphics.

I naively assumed that since it is a retro game that it would have similar requirements to those it was emulating.

The machine is HP Pavilion G6 so with that information could you advise games which would run on it?

I suppose the best bet is to mine the oldies. Back in the day and in the interim between I only really kept to the infinity engine camp of the classics in terms of isometrics with pillars being the recent addition to the list and Pathfinder Kingmaker but those latter two were on my desktop which I don't have access to now.

So what would you recommend new or old to fit the bill? I only really get interested in classic grimdark fantasy and steampunk. I haven't played wasteland, well only a bit and went off it at the time near release probably didn't have the patience for turn-based though do not rule that play style out.

Temple of Elemental Evil I did play a little long ago near release and while it was the same case as above of quitting due to turn based I do recall it had fantastic atmosphere and really immersive music. That sticks out to me. Same kind of immersive world feel as Pillars 1 gave me. I remember even though I didn't find the fighting interesting I wanted to just sit and listen to the music combined with the classic Forgotten Realms setting graphics.

That Obscura game I have read about from time to time as a classic of the genre but tbh the Victorian setting just seemed silly to me. I know it is a highly regarded sleeper hit but I could not get out of my comfort zone to try that setting as it just felt 'wrong' not being the classic medieval fantasy setting.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

Might and Magic 6, 7, and 8 and pretty fun, open world, old school RPGs. I think they are almost perfectly balanced, difficulty wise. Wizardry 8 is very similar but slower and more difficult.