The Dao of DA:O - playing blind

[JustKneller]

Now I remember why I stopped playing this game back in the day.

Technically. it's not a totally blind playthrough since I have dabbled with this game before, but I remembered nothing of the story or gameplay going into it, just that there was something about party combat that really put me off the game and it was partly something with the AI gambit system.

At this point, I'm past the intro with my female city elf rogue and fighting through the tower in the Ostegar battle. I still don't really remember anything, except what I didn't like about the game before.

I like the world. A fair amount of it is cliche (isn't the Joining essentially a simplified version of how they make Witchers, all part of the dangerous initiation to an inner circle trope)? Also, Genlocks and Hurlocks are basically goblins and hobgoblins, right? etc.), but it's coherent and still immersive. I have disliked elves in RPGs for a very long time (such an overrated/overused device). However, the presentation here (especially with the female city elf intro) has made me give a shit about elves, which hasn't happened in a very long time. I'm curious where this story leads.

The character mechanics are decent. Not an overwhelming amount of choice and there are enough options. The backgrounds are a nice way to blend premise with a tutorial.

But, I'm not liking party combat. If there was ever a game that needed to be fully turn based for combat, this is it. It would actually play faster if it was turn based. As it stands, I have to pause practically every second to either give orders or put a toon back on track with orders I gave it. The gambits are both a blessing and a curse. You can't really control the field (i.e. maintain a formation, defend weaker allies, etc.) or aggro (you can skew it, but it seems to ultimately be rng) and these two things go hand in hand.

I'm going to take a little side trip and talk about what became one of my last ever sessions of WotC D&D. It was a combat encounter with a group of mooks, maybe orcs or hobgoblins. It wasn't a big deal. We spent over three hours on that fight. Sure, there were a slightly higher than average number of players and so a slightly higher than average number of enemies to compensate. But, three and a half hours for a mook fight? It was mostly bookkeeping between everyone's specials and whatnot, but wow it was a slog and also the straw that broke the camel's back for me with this system.

Back to Dragon Age, I wonder how much real time is spent on my encounters. I would be interested to be able to do a replay after a fight to see how it would have played out in real time had I not needed to pause incessantly.

The other thing is that, much like my nearly last session of WotC D&D, a lot of the micro was moot because ultimately these encounters are just a melee mosh pit (maybe there are some archers/mages hanging back taking pot shots at the party), but since you can't maintain a formation and can only nudge aggro, it's mostly just DPS bedlam.

At this point, I'm either burning through healing potions or people are getting knocked out (and taking injuries) every fight. There are more of them then there are of us, so they dominate the melee mosh pit just with their numbers and can out flank really everyone all at once. Apparently, we can't set up choke points since enemies will walk "through" each other to break the line and surround. In the last fight, one Hurlock had a total hard on for the mage who couldn't drop him. So, while my other three toons were out numbered about 2:1 in the center of a melee, the mage was running circles around the outside of it all with a Hurlock hot on his heels like it was the closing credits of the Benny Hill Show. It would have been more immersive if "Yakkity Sax" was in the OST for that fight.

I'm no stranger to strategic/tactical games. X-com will always have a special place in my heart. Yet, even with X-com's RNG, you can pretty easily hedge your bets so that you have about a one in a hundred (or even thousand) chance of being screwed by RPG. Virtually every soldier I've lost in that game (and I rarely lose soldiers) could have been saved if I better evaluated the events leading up to their death. They were almost all avoidable surprises.

All that being said, I'm not saying the game is bad, or even flawed, in this regard. Many have played DA:O, I'm sure few have had the Benny Hill experience. For my part, I know I need to dig deeper with gambits and educate myself further. I've played plenty of FFXIV, so it can't really be that hard. However, there are some other quirks for which I'm not sure how to resolve.

1) The leading conflict between my tank and my finesse fighter. More specifically, at this point of the game, it's Alistair and my rogue. Though really you can throw the mage into the mix, too. I believe I should be "controlling" Alistair for exploration. This puts him on point and (hopefully) draws the aggro. I mean, he gets knocked out almost instantly when he succeeds and is surrounded by five goblins, but that's another problem. But, I believe I want to have him on point so that when the action starts, my rogue can circle the melee and start attacking from behind. It's a bit fussy in that I need Alistair to rush who I want him to rush and then switch over to my rogue to keep her from charging. Alistair doesn't always stick to the command I give him, though. So, it's a lot of micro back and forth.

2) If you have ever seen the movie Cadillac Man, there's a scene where Tim Robbins is pressing an assault rifle into Robin Williams' back and William's says, "Larry, you don't have to push it into my back to kill me. The gun, bullets come out, ya know?" I wish someone would tell my generic soldier that about his crossbow because he keeps charging the enemy to take his shots and won't just stay at range where I put him. As a result, he draws aggro and gets his ranged attacks constantly interrupted.

3) I'm not sure I want to play a rogue. I like the idea of a double dagger agile backstabber type (not to mention, I want a solid trapspringer and lockpicker), but the execution is a bit much. The more micro you have, the more you have to pause to adjust on the fly. I'm already cutting combat into one second slivers just to try to keep people on task. I want to play this character, but I'd like it to be less tedious.

4) The lack of field control and weak aggro management. If I have Alistair on point to draw aggro so my archer and mage can hang back and attack at range while my rogue tries to work the flank, I have three problems. One, Alistair, even on full defensive, can't survive that. Two, when you're outnumbered, as we usually are, rogue flanking is an illusion. She can flank Alistair's target, but not without wading into the mosh herself and now they are both surrounded and outnumbered (and the rogue is far more fragile). Three, keeping aggro off the back line. The enemy force is large enough that they can let a couple break off the melee to rush my back line and still outnumber Alistair and my rogue. Meanwhile, the back line is not built for direct confrontation, so they are even outmatched at even numbers.

That's where I am at this point. I'm open to feedback on how to improve the experience. Clearly, there's a piece of the puzzle I'm missing. That's what I think is at the core here. Not that the game is bad, but I'm overlooking something, and probably something obvious.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

Your point about getting outflanked and the general melee mosh pit is spot-on. There is not a whole lot you can do about this at the earliest levels. Soon after you leave Lothering you should make investing in crowd control a priority, there are a couple spell trees that are all about this and rogues and fighters both have some ability to do this as well. Morrigan is already suited to this job. This will greatly reduce headache and allow for more tactical play. You will also find items that further reduce/increase aggro.

As a rogue, consider making use of traps and stealth to assist in the crowd control aspect. Once you can stealth in mid-combat it is a lot easier to manage your aggro. My first playthrough was as a ranger and having another meat shield who could use Overwhelm was absolutely preferable to a bit more dps to me. I was a female dwarf noble, really had fun with that character and their unique culture and history.

Later on, there are certain spell combos that produce extra effects that really help in crowd control, like AoE knockback.

 

[JustKneller]

So, I've completely turned off gambits. I only had two set for each character. The first was use a poultice on themselves if their health was less than 25%. For the second, Alistair was to attack the nearest enemy and everyone else was to attack who Alistair was attacking. The result was everyone burning through all my healing poultices throwing them at each other, sometimes when they had more than 25% health. As for the attacking, Alistair spent a lot of time just standing around (and not stunned from a special attack), and others attacked random targets.

Yup. This I remember from back in the day.

In any event, the four stooges made it to the top of the tower and took down an ogre. It was a rough fight. Both Alistair and the mage were taken down. The mage went down right at the start when the ogre picked him up and smashed him around like a rag doll. Alistair lasted a little longer. From there, either Beatrix or the tower guard drew aggro and kited while the other took shots from range. Good thing ammo is unlimited because this took a while.

I'm hoping this is the end of it. Everyone is well stocked on injuries and I just want them to go back to camp and rest up.

 

[JustKneller]

Thankfully, the ogre was the end of it. Cutscenes happened from there and we ended up at the witch of the wilds' home. The party lost their two red shirts (the generic soldier and mage), but picked up a proper NPC in the form of a Shapeshifter mage (Morrigan). From there to the next town, the party was outright steamrolled in a random encounter. We crossed paths with the dog my rogue saved in Ostegar. It allied with us when we were subsequently attacked by about a dozen goblins. We did not last long at all. About eight of them, including an alpha, swarmed Alistair and shredded him fast. My rogue fell moments thereafter. I dropped the game before Morrigan met her guaranteed demise.

I'm starting to look up some builds for the game. It's clear to me now that this game is going to be more like IWD where we are plowing through gauntlets of enemies. Guerilla tactics aren't an option. Once a cluster of enemies activates, they are going to just charge and the party can't run off and drop them. The party needs a stronger front line, at least two people who can hold the aggro. I desperately need some CC as well. Both the generic mage and this new one seem to be rubbish at this. Maybe Alistair should be built for pure tanking. I haven't had much of an opportunity to do anything with him (just throw some level up points around), but he's a paper tiger in his current state.

Yeah, I'm not sure my move from here.

 

[Antimatter]

It might be an unpopular opinion. but I never ever used the AI in Dragon Age games. I guess this "gambit system" is a term from FF for the Tactics System in DA:O. Well, if it gives you more trouble than help, disable it and micro-manage everything.

In the beginning of the game, you don't have too many abilities on each character, so it's essentially what you said, giving orders every second to complete the same 1-2-3. Later on, the number of tactical options will increase substantially.

I would recommend Alistair as a complete tank, this is right, and it's especially difficult at the beginning of the game (you're still there). Then a rogue (e.g. with a bow), and 2 wizards. You don't have so many yet, and will have to do with a dog and other companions.

As for guerrilla tactics, well, you can use bows (they provide the biggest distance) and shoot at enemies from very far away for a few initial "rounds" of combat. Can be really helpful at the beginning (just keep bows as a secondary weapon on each).

 

[JustKneller]

It might be an unpopular opinion. but I never ever used the AI in Dragon Age games. I guess this "gambit system" is a term from FF for the Tactics System in DA:O.

I'm with you here. It's more hassle than help, and this is before more complicated abilities come into play. And yeah, "gambits" is a reference to FFXII where I first learned of the mechanic and have a ton of hours into that game so my brain automatically goes there. "Tactics" does make more sense, but I've already been programmed by Square-Enix.

As for guerrilla tactics, well, you can use bows (they provide the biggest distance) and shoot at enemies from very far away for a few initial "rounds" of combat.

I'm doing that, but it's less guerilla tactics and more just a quick volley to soften up (usually just one) enemy before we get swarmed. You can't really fade out, hit and run, or even hold a line.

I would recommend Alistair as a complete tank, this is right, and it's especially difficult at the beginning of the game (you're still there). Then a rogue (e.g. with a bow), and 2 wizards. You don't have so many yet, and will have to do with a dog and other companions.

I suppose I already started him down that path...I think. It would seem like a tank needs a lot for stats. Strength for armor, Dexterity to not get hit, and Constitution for Health. I've been dumping his points 1/1/1 into all three and he has the best defensive gear I've found so far, but he is still getting steamrolled. I was actually thinking I needed two tanks, a rogue, and a wizard so the tanks can share the heat. However, that does leave me a little light on damage.

In the Ostegar tower, I tried to have Alistair tank, the rogue work the crowd, keep the tower guard as an archer (they have the talents for it) and then the wizard would take pot shots with spells. However, Alistair getting swarmed was a death sentence every time. I ended up needing to have the tower guard and the rogue pull aggro, just so Alistair stood a chance. I'm also not sure I'm noticing a big difference with the rogue's damage when flanking (and I am being very careful about positioning).

In the current fight I lost on the highway to Lothering, I think it was an alpha and a mix of a half dozen goblins and hobgoblins. Even with the dog, Alistair pulled almost all the aggro and only lasted about 15 seconds or so. They managed to take down the alpha during that time, but the rabble was enough to overwhelm. Morrigan does not have very good CC, or even much by way if single target stun. Mind Blast is both risky and has a rather small AoE. Vulnerability Hex + Frost Weapons technically helps, but very little. Disorient+Horror is a rather mild single target debuff and disabler. Alistair and the rogue have shield bash and dirty fighting, but that's only going to buy a total of a few second on the alpha. My thought is that if they could disable either the rabble or (more likely) the alpha and then work the other, it could slow the tide. But, they don't have the tools for the job. I could shapeshift Morrigan into a spider and use Web + Overwhelm in succession to buy some time on the alpha, but it won't be much time.

Also, why two wizards and not, for example, two DPS rogues and a wizard?

And, if I max out stealth (or even have combat stealth), am I basically a Shadow Dancer? If so, I think I kinda just want a party of Cunning rogues.

I'm a little sad about "having to do" with dog. I was really hoping the dog I presume I'm about to rescue would be a contender as a solid companion.

 

[BelgarathMTH]

This post almost makes me want to play again sometime soon, so I can refresh my memory. I don't remember having nearly as much trouble with the combat as you're describing, although I do remember that ogre in the tower being a very, very hard fight at that level, and that I did a lot of kiting. (Btw, when you can get access to a Force Cage, or it's one of that line of spells that immobilizes but stops both action and damage, casting that on a friendly player that's caught in an ogre hold stops the damage.)

By mid-game, I always had my difficulty turned up to "nightmare", and I still thought it was too easy - I was phoning it in every combat, I guess because I had "solved the game", and I was just in it to finish the story at that point.

The only other thing I can think of is that 25% health is way too late to drink a potion. And maybe Allistair isn't built right? He was way tougher in my memory of the early game than you describe. Another thing I remember is that the game is very unforgiving about having just the right build. You can ruin a character with one or two bad skill picks. Any kind of attempting to be a hybrid doesn't work well, iirc. Mages, for example, need to focus on ONE line of magic skills.

Maybe my experience was different because I always played a mage, and developed as a healer and crowd control person?

My memory is far too fuzzy to give very useful advice, sorry. It's been years.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

And, if I max out stealth (or even have combat stealth), am I basically a Shadow Dancer? If so, I think I kinda just want a party of Cunning rogues.

I'm a little sad about "having to do" with dog. I was really hoping the dog I presume I'm about to rescue would be a contender as a solid companion.

Don't underestimate dog. His fast running speed and ability to use Overwhelm makes him one of the best anti-mage tools you have. And some mages will absolutely wreck your party if you don't deal with them quick. He's not your tank, so if he gets caught up use his Howl to stun the group and run off. He needs more micromanagement but he is not useless by any means.

From what I remember, yes, you are basically a shadowdancer once you take all stealth perks. It certainly has its uses, whether you are melee or ranged. I would plug ranger again for the stealth builds, since you can keep summoning your pets as you go in and out of stealth for consistent backup.

 

[JustKneller]

This post almost makes me want to play again sometime soon, so I can refresh my memory.

1. Replay D:AO
2. Tell me all your secrets.
3. ???
4. Profit! (At least, I do. )

I don't think it should be this hard. Or this oddly skewed. The ogre fight was my easiest fight so far (thanks to the large space and kiting). Meanwhile, run ins with what should be trash mobs are destroying me. I feel like I'm missing something so terribly basic like putting on armor or actually wielding weapons (but I did double check these two things).

The only other thing I can think of is that 25% health is way too late to drink a potion.

I don't think this was a problem, but partly because toons were drinking potions at higher than 25% anyway and even tossing them at each other. Like, something really wacky is going on with the tactics.

Another thing I remember is that the game is very unforgiving about having just the right build. You can ruin a character with one or two bad skill picks.

This could be. I am playing blind and just letting the in game knowledge be my guide. However, I have since looked up some builds and I'm pretty well on the mark for my rogue. I should look up how to build Alistair for tanking.

I would plug ranger again for the stealth builds, since you can keep summoning your pets as you go in and out of stealth for consistent backup.

I was thinking about this. I saw a thing where I eventually get to pick specializations and I believe I get to pick two. I figured Assassin is a sure pick, then Ranger seemed more fitting for someone who is now living on the road, at least more so than Bard or Duelist.

I am thinking of restarting. Not so much for mechanical reasons, but I think this character concept has fizzled out. Considering the intro is dealing with

Spoiler: spoiler alert

a bunch of rape-y human men, leaving her with even less trust towards human men, and now she kinda has to travel with one because he's the last known Grey Warden. And, you'd think that the irony of this would be a great roleplaying opportunity, but honestly it would make more sense for her to tell the human to sod off and go her own way. However to the however, it would be bad for survival to tell Alistair to take a hike.

In any event, I want to come up with a new concept where the intro lends itself to a rogue who decides to drink the Kool-Aid on this Warden deal. Maybe a Dhalish elf? That would support the whole Assassin/Ranger thing. I've thought about a Dwarf Commoner, too. However every character idea just involves into a crook that becomes a Warden as a hustle to get out of the slums and they would likely ditch the job after Ostegar.

 

[Antimatter]

Why 2 wizards you ask? Because I hate missing on spells jokingly, but only by half.

With 2 wizards in the same party, you can set them up as one offensive (Morrigan) and one defensive/healer (someone you haven't met yet). You put the majority of spells to good use and you provide balance to your team.

Restarting in DA:O is probably better than any other game, even in 2025. So many origins make it really fun, on top of different classes/setups.

 

[JustKneller]

So many origins make it really fun, on top of different classes/setups.

I do like the origins as a way to provide back story and as an orientation to the game. While they somewhat limit a character concept, I don't mean it in a bad way. More like it helps give some direction and orient you to this particular world.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

I do like the origins as a way to provide back story and as an orientation to the game. While they somewhat limit a character concept, I don't mean it in a bad way. More like it helps give some direction and orient you to this particular world.

I completely agree. I liked my original dwarf character from DAO so much, thanks in large part to the origin and how it tied heavily into the story, that I wanted to play all the way through to Inquisition to see what the ultimate fate of this character was based on my choices. I was satisfied with the answer I got.

I should really replay this series and try to do things differently so I can experience the sequels differently as well. I don't hate DA2 or Inquisition, even if they are inferior, although I understand why some do.

 

[JustKneller]

Spoiler: Reboot

So, it's a reboot with Revna Brosca. As you likely know, our lucky Duster is living the Carta life. However, she doesn't see herself as a criminal. After all, what is "crime" in a place without law. Perhaps on a subconscious level, she has some kind of concept of good and evil, but consciously she only thinks in terms of her family and her survival.

She has no judgement of Rica's schemes to provide a child to a noble. It's certainly far more preferable with potentially far more to gain than common prostitution. Revna makes her living off other talents. She has been able to avoid both the path of the harlot and (generally) that of the thug. Instead, she works for Beraht as a runner and thief (Stealth, Deft Hands, Stealing) and has been rather talented at ensuring she can get away with the latter (Cunning +5, Coercion). The actual act of stealing has become second nature to her, and often she doesn't even realize she swiped something until after the fact.

On some level, Revna hopes her half-sister's plan to marry a noble pans out so she can give up the criminal life, but this isn't because she has any qualms about her "criminal" vocation, just that living the cushy life of a noble is far more desirable than being a Duster pickpocket.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

If you make it all the way in this playthrough, do share how this origin ties into later events in the game, using spoiler tags of course. I am curious and I doubt I will be playing this origin any time soon, my next one is definitely going to be a human noble

 

[JustKneller]

One thing that I'm curious about is stealing. Particularly, with a master level in the skill, you can steal from bosses. But, am I not just going to kill the boss and then take their stuff?

 

[Antimatter]

I haven't tried stealing from enemies, but there are certainly good pickpocket targets in certain NPCs.

 

[JustKneller]

Spoiler: In Game

Revna's day started with getting a hard time from Beraht, and putting up with him doing the same to her sister, Rica. Beraht was a toad, but working for him was the best game in town. Still, treating her sister the way he did would come back to bite him. Revna was sure of this.

The toad sent her to see her friend, Leske, to get her job for the day. Their assignment was to crack the skull of a surfacer merchant who was skimming from the boss. When they found the thief, Revna took a bribe to let him live as long as he left Dust Town and never came back. It was risky to double cross Beraht, but after how he treated Rica, Revna thought it was worth the risk.

After lying to Beraht about the merchant, they took their next job of the day. They were to rig a Proving fight run by the warrior caste. The duo successfully sabotaged the favored win, but Beraht's pick was passed out drunk. The only option they saw was for Revna to take his place. His armor would conceal her identity, and if she won, nobody would be the wiser.

Revna was victorious. She almost got away with it, but then the drunk roused enough to stagger into the arena and her bunko was blown. Revna was apprehended. Surely the warrior caste would condemn her to certain death for making a mockery of the Proving. However, the cages in which Leske and she found herself awaiting execution were actually Beraht's.

The toad clearly had more pull than Revna, but Revna had more push. The pair sprung themselves from their cages, drum up some weapons, and fight their way out of Beraht's lair. Their gauntlet ended in a confrontation with Beraht himself. He was a stout fighter, but Revna and Leske were a team, and they also knew how to fight dirty.

Revna found some satisfaction in dropping the dwarf. But she also realized it complicated her employment situation. Maybe she could take his place, but she didn't have his connections so that was unlikely. She didn't get far in plotting her next move. They were met with the warrior caste guards as soon as they left Beraht's headquarters and so apprehended again.

Revna was still to die for her offense against the Proving. However, there was a Grey Warden in their company and he offered her an invitation to join up with him instead. It was an easy choice. As much as she didn't want to be separated from Rica, this was now inevitable. The only difference was whether they would be separated by death or conscription. At least with the Grey Wardens, she could gain some status and could send for Rica once she establishes herself.

Wow, stealing is underrated. Revna didn't pick up anything of major value, but a lot of lesser heals, injury kits, and other little trinkets. She fought the arena fights like a proper rogue, with kiting and dirty fighting. Fighting her way out of Beraht's was pretty easy, too. Two rogues who can sneak, flank, and fight dirty can get a fight off to a good start.

By the end of it all, she had a skill point in Combat Training, and talents with dual weapon and Below the Belt. Attribute points are going 2:1 in Cunning: Dexterity. My thought is that more Dexterity makes her a stronger fighter, but Cunning makes her a little more glass cannon. However, Cunning is also boosting her (I think) Coercion, Deft Hands, Stealing, Stealth so she'll have more utility. If I can figure out how to manage aggro, her fragility shouldn't be a problem.

 

[WarChiefZeke]

Spoiler: In Game

Revna's day started with getting a hard time from Beraht, and putting up with him doing the same to her sister, Rica. Beraht was a toad, but working for him was the best game in town. Still, treating her sister the way he did would come back to bite him. Revna was sure of this.

The toad sent her to see her friend, Leske, to get her job for the day. Their assignment was to crack the skull of a surfacer merchant who was skimming from the boss. When they found the thief, Revna took a bribe to let him live as long as he left Dust Town and never came back. It was risky to double cross Beraht, but after how he treated Rica, Revna thought it was worth the risk.

After lying to Beraht about the merchant, they took their next job of the day. They were to rig a Proving fight run by the warrior caste. The duo successfully sabotaged the favored win, but Beraht's pick was passed out drunk. The only option they saw was for Revna to take his place. His armor would conceal her identity, and if she won, nobody would be the wiser.

Revna was victorious. She almost got away with it, but then the drunk roused enough to stagger into the arena and her bunko was blown. Revna was apprehended. Surely the warrior caste would condemn her to certain death for making a mockery of the Proving. However, the cages in which Leske and she found herself awaiting execution were actually Beraht's.

The toad clearly had more pull than Revna, but Revna had more push. The pair sprung themselves from their cages, drum up some weapons, and fight their way out of Beraht's lair. Their gauntlet ended in a confrontation with Beraht himself. He was a stout fighter, but Revna and Leske were a team, and they also knew how to fight dirty.

Revna found some satisfaction in dropping the dwarf. But she also realized it complicated her employment situation. Maybe she could take his place, but she didn't have his connections so that was unlikely. She didn't get far in plotting her next move. They were met with the warrior caste guards as soon as they left Beraht's headquarters and so apprehended again.

Revna was still to die for her offense against the Proving. However, there was a Grey Warden in their company and he offered her an invitation to join up with him instead. It was an easy choice. As much as she didn't want to be separated from Rica, this was now inevitable. The only difference was whether they would be separated by death or conscription. At least with the Grey Wardens, she could gain some status and could send for Rica once she establishes herself.

Wow, stealing is underrated. Revna didn't pick up anything of major value, but a lot of lesser heals, injury kits, and other little trinkets. She fought the arena fights like a proper rogue, with kiting and dirty fighting. Fighting her way out of Beraht's was pretty easy, too. Two rogues who can sneak, flank, and fight dirty can get a fight off to a good start.

By the end of it all, she had a skill point in Combat Training, and talents with dual weapon and Below the Belt. Attribute points are going 2:1 in Cunning: Dexterity. My thought is that more Dexterity makes her a stronger fighter, but Cunning makes her a little more glass cannon. However, Cunning is also boosting her (I think) Coercion, Deft Hands, Stealing, Stealth so she'll have more utility. If I can figure out how to manage aggro, her fragility shouldn't be a problem.

Cunning is indeed boosting your skills like stealing, coercion, etc. It also has its other uses, like boosting certain class abilities (in the bard class especially) or acting as a replacement for strength if you take the perk.

Stealing is fun because in this game there are a lot of very expensive and very powerful artifacts and if you aren't careful with your money you won't be able to afford even one, let alone all of them. So every little bit of gold helps. Some are good enough that they remain best-in-slot even past the DLCs like Awakening.

 

[JustKneller]

Spoiler: In Game

Their first stop was the ruined fortress of Ostegar, now a staging ground for a battle with the blight. It was a grim affair, which was made apparent to Revna when she found that there was really nothing worth stealing. As she made her rounds, she found that she was the only dwarf there. There were a handful of elves, but the few she saw were all servants to the humans. Seeing this she was wary of the esteem the humans may hold toward the dwarves.

Revna helped one of the humans with an ill war dog. She then met up with the Grey Warden to find out what was to happen next. She was to journey into the wilds with two other initiates and a junior warden to procure darkspawn blood for their initiation ritual. They also needed to pick up some old scrolls at a Grey Warden ruin in the area. The woods were pockmarked with squads of darkspawn and they put up a good fight. Revna was fortunate for the healing poultices she managed to "procure" in Dust Town and the camp. They found the Grey Warden ruins and were met by Morrigan, a witch of the wilds. The scrolls were long gone, but safely in the custody of Morrigan's mentor. Fortunately, she gave them to the party without incident. They returned to the camp to prepare for the ritual. Revna was feeling confident over their success and chanced a pickpocket of Duncan. She managed to pick up a Master Cold Iron Rune. She had no idea what to do with it, but it looked valuable so she decided she would hold onto it for now.

The darkspawn blood was to be made into an elixir to be consumed by the initiates. The chatty human drank of the chalice first. The darkspawn blood did not agree with him and his life was forfeit. The mopey human then refused to drink and wanted to return home. When he drew his blade, Duncan acted fast and dispatched him. Revna thought this was overkill and they should have just let him go home, but she kept this to herself. It was now her turn. What a choice. The chalice or the blade? She figured her odds were better with the chalice. Somebody had to survive this ritual, right?

I'm a mathematician at heart. A lot of choices get a lot easier if you just run the numbers and the numbers here are pretty straight forward. The field is not much of a factor so once aggro is triggered, it's just a matter of how much dps you can dish out versus how much you can take. More accurately, it's about how much your tank can take since the plan is for them to pull all the aggro. And I'm thinking that this is why I'm getting steamrolled. I have to do enough dps to clear the other side, but I can only absorb their dps with my tank(s) which makes the dps absorption of my other characters almost moot.

Looking at the floaty numbers, the goblins are pretty close to on par with our DPS. However, there are a) more of them, b) they only need to take down one of my toons to break the line and overrun us, and c) I have to take down every one of them to succeed. The only silver lining is that health regenerates after every battle. I just need to survive the fight.

Looking at the numbers, nobody is really built for tanking. Alistair has the shield talent to help him against archers, but everyone's armor and defense is pretty comparable. Alistair and Jory come out ahead for hit points being warriors. Otherwise, it's pretty even.

Strategically speaking, there really is no strategy. The opposition's dps is a combination of all their combatants individual dps. The most effective approach might be to target one enemy at a time to whittle down their combined dps (rather than spread out your attacks), focusing on the enemy with the highest dps-to-hp ratio. Meanwhile, (try to) spread out the aggro so make the most out of everyone's hp.

On top of that, I've minimized activations. This feels kinda cheesy, though. That is, I have three bows between everyone. I gave Jory's longbow to Alistair because I'd rather he draw the aggro. I let Daveth keep his longbow. Somewhere along the way, I picked up a shortbow that Revna is carrying. However, the range is shorter so she can only help once enemies close the gap some. The party only gets close enough to a crowd for the longbowmen to target the closest enemy. They then let loose their arrows. This draws only part of the crowd, or just the single enemy if we're lucky. By breaking up larger groups, it cuts down on the group dps with the added bonus of softening up the enemies while they close the gap.

I probably should be focusing more on combat talents and skills, but I ended up going with Coercion 2, Stealth 2. I want to make sure I stay ahead of the utility curve. I don't want to risk bungling a speech check and the Stealth will help with the Stealing as well. Fortunately, being Cunning focused will hedge my bets. From this point, though, I'll probably do more combat training and dual-wield, then try to rush Lethality so I can get more mileage out of my Cunning. Then maybe I'll dip back into (Combat) stealth, Coercion, stealing and locks.

 

[JustKneller]

Spoiler: Fatality! Alistair Wins!

Enough analysis. I just thought I'd share a particularly fortuitous screenshot of Alistair dispatching a Hurlock that charged my party.